Wednesday, February 4, 2009

So many targets, so few guns. Armored Vehicles.

*This list was written with the 3rd ed IG and WH codexes. The theory still applies though*

Chambers had asked me about writing up something about used car lists. A Used car list would be a light armor spam type list.

Light armor spam? Isn't a rhino just a rolling coffin? Why the heck would you want to try something as silly as using a rhino as a real tank?

The truth is, that by itself, one or two rhinos are no match for anti-tank. It's really a simple problem of target priority for your enemy. If the rhinos are high priority, because either there are no larger tanks, or because there are not many tanks, the rhinos will take a lot of shots, and get destroyed.

So How do you get around this problem?
Get big armor.
A Land Raider, or Leman Russ both fit the bill nicely. Big tanks draw attention away from the transports, and hopefully pull big antitank guns like lascannons away from something they'd pop really easily (rhinos).

Big Armor isn't a bad option. I like to employ this strategy myself, but Big Armor is not the only answer. Sometimes it's hard to get the big tank. Like for WH, I have to take 2 platoons of IG, or 2 Armored Fists to get a Russ.

Get big numbers.
Get big numbers? I've found that 3 tanks in 1500pts isn't bad to deal with. a lot of armies field about 3 tanks. but if you've got Light tanks, what are you supposed to do? Your enemy should be easily able to dispatch your 3 light tanks.
I remembered the U.S in WW2. The Sherman tanks weren't nearly as good as a German Panzer. The Panzer outclassed the Sherman in many ways. The two couldn't really go toe to toe. The advantage the U.S. had was numbers. They could make a lot MORE shermans.

So why not try it with my little plastic tanks? The Immolator isn't that impressive, but it is cheap. for the less than the price of 1 barebones Russ, I can get 2 Immolators.

playing with the list:
When building forces, I like to take ideas, and see if I can make something viable out of taking the list to an extreme. The Light Armored company was an idea that came out of an extreme.
In a standard WH force org chart, you can take a lot of transport type tanks. The Immolator is a decent transport tank, built on the rhino chassis.
You have to start with 2 rhinos full of SoB's for troops.
1Immolator with a cannoness and minimal retinue.
3 Heavy Support Immolators (posibly even with retribution squads)
3 Immolators with 3 elite Celestian squads
3Fast attack Immolators with Dominions
You quickly can approach 12-13 possible light tanks.

Then you give the squads inside Meltaguns, or Hflamers/flamers. You can have a lot of targets, 10 of which can lay down a twin-linked Hflamer on you.

Most opponents won't take enough Anti-tank or anti-light tank to deal with 10+ tanks screaming across the board. Of course, you might be screamed AT for bringing your used car collection to the table. I like to refer to these lists as Saganaki lists (flaming cheese).

a more workable idea:
I prefer lists using a few bigger tanks to them. It's hard for me to resist getting a Leman Russ in a WH list, while I still can.
I start off with the standard 2 SoB squads in rhinos, and a Jumpy cannoness (although I might try to get a Celestian retinue in an immo sometime.)
2 Exorcists (because they work better in pairs)
Then take the 2 Armored Fists in their Chimera w/Multilaser, Hbolter. I will typically give a Missile launcher and Vet Sarge to the squad. ( I like the ld8)
I then get a Leman Russ, usually with Lascannon and Hbolter sponsons.
If I have points left over, Tank-hunter Seraphim. Or something in another light tank.

The WH portion comes to about 1000pts, and the 2 AF's and Russ to about 500. 500pts is not a bad price to put down 2 medium and 1 Heavy tank.

If you're keeping score, it's 1 Big Russ, 2Exorcists, 2Chimera, 2Rhinos, and maybe an Immolator.
7-8 tanks is a lot of tanks. Not as many as a full-out immolator-fest, but the Russ will take a lot of hits, and gives you 4 troops choices on the board. It's more armor than a lot of armies want to deal with in a turn or two, which should protect your rhinos and your Exorcists, as the Russ will be your main FireMagnet now, not your transports barelling to unload anti-infantry doom.

This type of WH Armored Company is a playable list, and I don't feel it's AS lopsided as the saganaki Immolator fest. It still operates off some of the principles the Immo fest does. More armor means target saturation for your enemy. Your opponent can't kill them all at once. Something's going to make it to it's target. Another force I've seen do a Light armor spam list well was Dark Eldar. So many troops, in so many transports, with so many lances...

The Immo fest list is a much more in-your-face playstyle though, and the WH Armored Company has more of a tank gunline feel to it, with 2 SoB squads to act as knives, and the cannoness to punch like a dagger.


  1. that is just sick, at 1500 my CSM army can just squeeze in 5 light armor vehicles, and that's only by taking 2 crazy dreads 3 troops and not much else.

  2. I ground the points through Armybuilder tonight.

    at 1500, I came up with 8Immolators, and 2rhinos.

    so 2SoB squads, VSSw/bolter, book of St. Lucius, Hflamer/flamer in rhinos w/extra armor

    2 Palatines w/eviscerators and BoSL, Celestian retinue (5 Celestians) w/2meltas in Immolators w/extra armor

    3Celestian squads (5Celestians)w/2meltas in immolators w/extra armor

    3Heavy Support Immolators w/extra armor

    for a total of 10 Light armor in 1500pts, 2 Evisc, 10 meltas, 2Hflamer/flamer SoB squads, and 8 twin-linked Hflamers. 9 faith. If you drop a few melta, you can get up to 11 faith by switching Palatines to Cannonesses.

  3. Thanks, I enjoyed reading this!

    You may have noted the battle I had in Dec '08 (post #071 on my blog) - you might enjoy the light vehicle army list and picture there.*

    Sadly, I've no idea about WH points values...but I do know that currently the IG chimeras are overpriced!

    Oh, and I'm finding some of the writing on here really tricky to read...

    I look forward to reading more!

    - Drax.

    * There are fairly recent photos too, on posts 081 and 087, if you're interested.

  4. I've looked at those posts! Very nice indeed.

    It reminds me of how I wanted to do IG when I started. I wanted an Armageddon Steel Legion style army, with Heavy Weapons and lots of tanks.

    WH values are the same as IG point values. I put up the WH Armored Company list, if you want to get a general idea of costs.
    Immolators cost similar to 4th ed Space Marine codex Razorbacks.

    I apologize for some of the writing being odd. I generally write while I work, and don't always have uninterupted time. My ideas seem a bit disjointed, it's probably because I got interrupted by my flow cytometer or by a customer wanting assistance.

    I'll try to do a better job proof-reading and editing in the future!

  5. No, mate - sorry! - it's not your words that I'm finding difficult (God knows that's the last thing I'm going to start criticising people for) I'm having trouble seeing the light blue against the buff backgound!

    Hope I didn't cause offence...

    - And thanks for the replies.

  6. no offense taken. I can be pretty critical of my own work.

    finding typo's and poor grammatical structure in my own writing can be like fingernails down the chalkboard to me.

    I'm always open to suggestions on color and contrast. I darkened the blue a bit.
    The contrast between the burnt orange-brown and blue can be tricky. I admit.
    I almost made the background closer to the followed link lighter orange when I started. it was hard to read.


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