So as I was thinking about weapons and 6th today I noticed some VIP's in the 40k universe just got boned by using axe's.......
That's correct power axes are AP2 now but unwieldy which means they strike at initiative 1. So here goes the crying party:
Poor Astorath! No more initiative 5.
I guess the vampires like axes to cut up their food. Poor Dante no more initiative 6.
Even the evil fall to initiative 1! Kharn the Betrayer
Even my beloved Logan Grimnar with his frost axe. Why even use it. JUST use it as a fist at strength 8 instead of 7.Surely this will be fixed. Right? Any of your models that have been suddenly punk slapped with 8th?
My orks get stuck at initiative 1.....wait a minute!!!!!
ReplyDeletenope, dat's a choppa!
DeleteWell Fuegan has an ax. But its rules say it makes him attack like a monstrous creature. So it looks like an ax, but actually makes him +1 strength, ap 2, and get 2 dice for armor penetration at I7. It's not in the FAQ or the appendix like most of the named elder melee weapons. Go figure.
ReplyDelete(sigh...)
ReplyDeleteOn the one hand, I REALLY don't need the Sang Priests anymore. On the other, certain enemies will just eat my Sang Guard for lunch. Unless I go buy 2 or 3 more boxes of Sang Guard so I can give everyone swords instead.
Or maybe I'll just buy 2 boxes of Panther tanks instead and have a whole new army to play with. :P
I might have some left over Sang Guard bits. Haven't looked in the box lately, so I'm not exactly sure what I have.
DeleteI would need something like 9 at least. But I can proxy as whatever as long as someone can tell me definitively what my rules are. :(
DeleteOh how the mighty fall...
ReplyDeleteInteresting times... maybe I'll just take Contemptor "Mortis" Pattern dreadnoughts to combat flyers in 6th... seeing as they have the AA rule which allows them to fire at flyers if they stand still and the super duper shielding which grant them a 6+ inv save in close combat.
Ahhh... sorry... butterflies... corners...
CK
Actually, most of those are not getting the treatment, like logan, because it has special rules it is over ridden I believe.
ReplyDeleteIf the power weapon has one or more special rules, it counts as being unusual. Unusual power weapons count as ap3. So all of those special characters have ap3 weapons along with their special rules.
ReplyDeleteI have a couple of random models with axes like 2 of my honor guard, assault marine sergeant, and for some reason I think maybe a terminator librarian.
ReplyDeleteYou just got the beloved Logan since in his rules he has either a Frost Blade or a Power Fist. Since it's not written Frost Axe our Wolfy wolf dodged the Nerf bat!
ReplyDeleteThe rules also say to look at the weapon itself to determine what type it is, if it's a power "weapon" rather than a power (type). Since Frost weapons are listed in the book the same way, you look at the model - if it's an ax, it's a frost ax.
DeleteHowever, it also says what stillfrosty is talking about, that "unique weapons" are AP3 with their special rules in effect.
I don't have the rules in front of me (or available), but if it says he has a frost blade, and is modeled with an ax, it's a Frost Ax and follows those rules.
It's said on the rules that I have to choose each attack between Power Fist or Frost Blade. It may be very well a Power Axe but I cannot choose to use it as such. Since the weapon entry states that I have to choose between using it as a Sword or a Power Fist it looks to me that it's codex over rulebook
DeleteAlso, Frost Blade and Frost Axe have specific profiles in the C:SW FAQ, so they do not count as Unusual Power Weapons, And since the wording for Logans Axe specifically says Frost Blade, then that is what I intend to use.
DeleteAlso, just been pointed out that if a Power/Force weapon has any special rule on it it's treated as an AP3 weapon using only it's own rules as per the Unusual Power Weapon.
ReplyDeleteSo, this means that the Executioner's Axe jumped out of the Initiative 1 conga line, as well as Kharn's axe.
Now, here is a nice question. Being only master-crafted is a weapon safe from becoming unyielding?
For example, Dante's axe is only a master-craft force weapon, which means it's a master-crafter Power AXE or it's an Unusual Power Weapon?
Same thing goes for Sandwyrm's Sanguinary Guards, are they only an AP3 unusual weapon or it's a Power Sword/Axe? As a side note, yes they are swords on the codex picture but in fact a Glaive is a polearm which would become a Power Axe, and since it's not stated anywhere what it really is you could model them anyhow you lie IMO.
The Sanguinary Guard kit comes with 3 swords and 2 axes.
DeleteThe fact that no 2 people seem to be able to agree on what anything does in 6th has me worried more than anything. WTF?
So I could have flying terminators with AP2 weapons, guess you were right on your sanguinary preview a few posts back.
DeleteYeah, the fault is bad FAQ and not enough reading on their part, but we can't expect GW to read stuff before they FAQ things out
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteSo, basically it can be, that with the Glaive Encarmine is master-crafted it could count as unusual? I'm currently waiting on GW to clarify via e-mail :).
DeleteThe Chaos FAQ states that Kharn has a Power Axe that rolls an extra D6 for armor penetration against vehicles. So he does get hit with the Init 1, but will strike at Str 7 on the charge and Str 6 normally.
DeleteThe Sang Guard thing seems rather simple to me. You will look at the weapons and see what type it is, sword or axe, and you get to apply the master crafted rule to it. What I believe they are referring to when they talk about "Special Rules" are rules that are not covered in the 40k rule book. Look at the GK weapons, they all have their own unique rules depending on the weapon, this will let them keep those rules but are only considered AP3. The GK FAQ back this up.
If this would be true, than they would have written, that Astartoth has a unusual power weapon. They didn't. Also the rulebook says under no condition "not represented in this book" or anything like that.
DeleteI think you forgot that bad things don't happen to Imperials. Out of all of these, the only one that would likely be affected by default is Logan, because it is just "a frost blade." The others are all Unusual, so they don't default to the Power Weapon category table; they just become AP3 + their listed special rules.
ReplyDeleteBut Logan doesn't even have to deal with it, because the Space Wolves FAQ has a specific entry for Frost Blades, which is what it says he has.
However, because Kharn made the mistake of forgetting to be Imperial, they specifically FAQ'd Gorechild to be a Power Axe.
Shouldn't be Typhus up there? He has a Psi-Axe and a friend of mine, playing chaos, says it should give him I2 himself, couldn't check myself, because I was busy preparing another mini (one of the I've bought before 6th hit)...
ReplyDelete*I1, sorry typo...
DeleteIt's a deamonic weapon and you should not need more 'unusual' than that, right? et that's an Force Axe...
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteNah the FAQ sys t's a psi axe. end of discussion?
DeleteDante is in danger, but Astorath has an unusual weapon.
ReplyDeleteThe blood angels have been nerfed fool stop.... Dante is now lame with his axe no point in initiate 6 and Astaroth is now lame although he would be strength 8 because of the executioners axe attacks at strength 6 initially.
ReplyDeleteapologies for spelling.
DeleteHmm I might eventually model some Vet Sisters Superiors with axes. Losing a little I, for some Str, and AP might not be a bad trade for them. Since most of the armies I'd face (except Tau, Orks, and IG) would be hitting me first anyway.
ReplyDeleteI could also see a similar rationale for IG. Break out them axes, lads!
But what about if it looks like an axe and doesn't have 2 special rules.....?
ReplyDeletehmm. if it looks like an axe, and hacks like an axe...
DeleteI'd call it an axe.
but that's also a found ambiguity in the new rules. Maybe GW will FAQ it soon.
<3 Spag- This means logan wing is dead right? I mean he only swings at I1 now so he's poop? bahahahahaahaha On a serious note have you thought about the bloodthirster? He has an axe. . .soooo does that mean he is I1 also?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSooo if i understand right logan has a +1 strength ap3 axe. I'd read it the way ANY frost weapon folliws the +1 special rule and therefore is not a standard issue energy weapon, so any of them just get +1 S and ap3!
ReplyDeleteAm i correct here?
No, he either has a frost blade (+1 Str and AP3) or a power fist (2x Str and AP2) frost axe is +2 Str and AP2
DeleteSome of my Necrons got hit with the nerf bat. The Triarch Praetorians have a +1 strength unwieldy close combat weapon. I think that, because of the Necron's piss-poor initiative, this is actually better than the original weapon.
ReplyDelete